Oral history interview with Inez Ribustello, 2022

Erin Lawrimore: Today is Friday, October 28th, 2022. We are at the New Hanover County Public Library, and I am Erin Lawrimore. I'm doing an interview for our Well Crafted NC project. To start, can we have you say and spell your name? Inez Ribustello: My name is Inez Ribustello. I-N-E-Z, and my last name is R-I-B like boy, U-S-T-E-L-L-O. Erin Lawrimore: Alrighty. And Inez is the owner. Is that the title you use? Inez Ribustello: President. Erin Lawrimore: President. Everyone uses a different title. Inez Ribustello: Yeah, I think my cards say wholesale manager. Erin Lawrimore: But we are here to talk about Tarboro Brewing Company and Inez's career. Let's start off. Can you tell us a little bit about yourself, just where are you from and what was the road before you got into this industry? Inez Ribustello: Sure. Born and raised in Tarboro, proud graduate of Tarboro High School. I moved up to Chapel Hill to go to college. And when I graduated, I left for the first time north of the Mason-Dixon line and went to New York to culinary school where I ended up working in wine, becoming a sommelier. I was the beverage director at Windows on the World until 9/11, and then moved to France to work harvest, very wine-centric. And my fiancé, who's also a sommelier, he and I bought with the help of 00:01:00 my dad and another investor on the Square Restaurant in Wine Store. In October of 2022, we just celebrated 20 years. But yeah, we were restaurateurs, sommeliers who were following the craft 00:02:00 beer scene in Eastern North Carolina. Is that okay? Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. Do you- Inez Ribustello: I could keep talking and- Erin Lawrimore: Nope. And honestly, don't worry about it. Inez Ribustello: Okay. Erin Lawrimore: The more, the merrier for an interview like this. I think it's an interesting background because I think wine and beer don't always intersect around here in the same way that... They seem to run in two different worlds as in some places. Inez Ribustello: Yeah, which is really, it's really fascinating for me because when I was working in New York, I went to beer dinners at Gramercy Tavern with Garrett Oliver at Brooklyn Brewery. And we were, as beverage professionals, taught to be as intentional with our beer programs as we were with our wine, as we were with our spirits. And I remember the first time I visited a winery in Santa Barbara, the two gentlemen who owned it were sitting on the stoop drinking Corona. And when I got out of the car, I said, "Oh man, you all are drinking beer." And they said, "It takes a lot of beer to make great wine." And even when I 00:03:00 work these really high profile events in New York or San Francisco that are wine-based, the sommeliers are in the back event room drinking ice cold beer because there is something super refreshing about well made beer, and it's a craft beverage. It's interesting to me, and I can talk about what I have learned in terms of the psychology of beer drinkers and wine drinkers all day long. But yeah, it's interesting that they don't intersect as much as 00:04:00 I would like or as much as I would think. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. We'll cycle back around to that- Inez Ribustello: Yes. Meet me in jet air because I- Erin Lawrimore: ... and some of the differences that you say. No, because I think that's a really interesting thing. And I think that having the sommelier background has... We'll talk more about how that plays into the 00:05:00 beer world today, especially here in North Carolina. Can you remember back then what some of the 00:06:00 beers that were your introduction to craft beer would've been? Inez Ribustello: Yeah. In New York, we were definitely focused on Brooklyn Brewery, and then Ommegang in upstate New York. I remember the Hennepin release. Anchor Steam was a big one for us at Windows. But yeah, we really focused on New York breweries in at Windows. But when I came to North Carolina and we opened on the Square, immediately we were drawn to Duck-Rabbit just because of the closeness to it. And I think that's the beauty of beer, is it can be made anywhere, very much unlike wine. And when Sean at Fullsteam got the Pop the Cap, I remember... Well, let me back up to 1998 when I think I had just turned 22. I found a Texas hefeweizen, the Pyramid, and I thought it was the best beer I'd ever had in my life. And I remember drinking it all summer long. And then when the Pop the Cap happened, I fell in love with Chimay Rouge out of Belgium, just that whole... And then there was a black lager out of Brazil, I think, that I really liked. But I was, again, there is just something really delicious and refreshing about beer that I enjoyed in addition to wine. I 00:07:00 didn't replace. It's not like you need to replace one with the other. Erin Lawrimore: Right. No, that makes total sense. You mentioned that when you got to Tarboro, you opened your restaurant. Did you have an extensive for the time beer menu then? Inez Ribustello: Oh, absolutely. Erin Lawrimore: You mentioned Duck-Rabbit. What else for you? Inez Ribustello: Well, before we started, I mentioned to you that Robert Poitras, founder of Carolina Brewery, is from Tarboro. We dedicated our two taps to Carolina Brewery. Erin Lawrimore: Oh, wow. Inez Ribustello: So we had, oh gosh, their Sky Blue always on tap. And then we would rotate the other one. Their Copperline, I think, is one of the most delicious beers I've ever had. But we do their seasonal, their holiday one. That was on draft. And then we had probably 14 to 20 different labels. When Mother Earth opened, we bought all four of theirs. Fullsteam opened, we started buying whatever they had. And then obviously Duck-Rabbit, and then a lot of international beers. We've always done, oh gosh, the Austrian grapefruit, Stiegl Radler. What a great beer. I've always tried to support North Carolina and just breweries. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. Inez Ribustello: Yeah. But we did. And it was funny because Stephen was like, "I think we're 00:08:00 losing money on beer," because he and I and our staff were drinking beer. We didn't sell a lot of beer. But it's important to have because you're always going to have 00:09:00 someone who just drinks beer. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. Well, and that's what I was going to ask too, when you opened the restaurant with these local beers. You said 2002. Inez Ribustello: We did, yep. Erin Lawrimore: That was well before North Carolina had a craft beer scene, really. Inez Ribustello: Yeah. Erin Lawrimore: Did folks in the community know what to do with craft beers? Or did you all have to teach? Inez Ribustello: Well, Tarboro was fortunate because Robert was from there. They knew about Carolina Brewery and were avid supporters. We would've been terrible people had we not had Carolina Brewery on tap. And Robert's been a huge, huge mentor to both Stephen and me, and we just are grateful for the time he has spent really 00:11:0000:10:00 advocating for us. So they did know Carolina Brewery. And then Duck-Rabbit people would drive to Farmville from Tarboro. And we tried to do staff training around beer, which was really easy. It was so fascinating to see how much more comfortable our staff was talking about beer than they were about wine. They related to it more so, and it seemed less intimidating for them. And they seem to enjoy it more after a shift. And so also, Stephen and I are huge believers in tasting. So 00:12:00 if somebody came in and said, "I've never had a craft beer before," we'd pour them a taste because while I can tell you how I describe it all day long, it really is how you digest it. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. And were you all doing much in the way of formal pairings or thinking through food plus beer? Or was it food and beer? Inez Ribustello: Yes. Stephen and I always loved pairing beverages, whatever they are, mocktails, cocktails, beer, one with food. And so people would say, "I'm going to get this. What's a great beer?" And normally, I was working the floor and so I could do that. And I think just organically, our staff felt enabled to do that too, empowered. Erin Lawrimore: What led you just to go from the restaurant to opening your own brewery? Inez Ribustello: Stephen and I bought a 10,000 square foot building in summer of '08 in hopes of moving the restaurant there because everybody said we'd outgrown the space that we were in. And then fall of '08, the whole bottom of 00:13:00 the world fell out. The economy tanked and no one wanted to invest in a restaurant, period, much less when in Edgecombe County. So we'd been following Duck-Rabbit. Mother Earth was on the cusp of opening. It opened in 2010. And my kids were starting public school at the time. And I 00:14:00 was realizing a lot of those parents and families that I was seeing in my kids' schools, I never saw in the restaurant. And thought a brewery would be perfect in this spot, and also I think it has much more of an ability to be a community space than a restaurant does. But of 00:15:00 course, I only drink beer. I don't brew beer. And this is the other cool Tarboro connection. But this guy I went to a school with my whole life, he and I went to the same church together, 00:16:00 he's a couple years younger, he had left Tarboro to go to boarding school outside of Philadelphia. And he's in the 10th grade, I think. Anyway, he stayed up there and graduated from Haverford College, went to Flying Dog in New Jersey, and then ended up working at Yards Brewing in Philadelphia. Big time, moved up until he was the director of quality assurance. Erin 00:17:00 Lawrimore: Wow. Inez Ribustello: So he would come home for Christmas to visit his parents. I was like, "Hey Franklin, we can't do this without you. It's our dream because we think it has huge potential and legs, but we can't do it without a brewer." And Stephen and I both believe in you need to know what you're doing. We're not going to just go and half, say, "Hey, I know this is going to brew. You've never done it before, but let's wing it." If you're going to put the investment in, your community deserves to have really great beer. And Franklin looked at the space like, "Man, this is phenomenal space." He's like, "Yeah, good luck raising the money. If you raise the money, 00:18:00 I'll talk to you." And that was in 2010. Wrote the business plan, started the Indiegogo 00:19:00 crowdfunding campaign in '13, got the doors open in '16. By that time, the number of craft breweries in North Carolina had tripled. Erin Lawrimore: Now, were you all the first though in Edgecombe County? Or were there others already in the county? Inez Ribustello: We are the only people who have the guts to do it. Erin Lawrimore: That's what I thought. You were. Inez 00:20:00 Ribustello: Yeah. Erin Lawrimore: That's what I thought. Did you all run into any local legislative issues with opening, or was the city county pretty supportive of everything? Inez Ribustello: We do not take for granted the support of our town in our county. They were the ones. So we had talked to two people who came to the restaurant all the time and told them what we wanted. And they're like, "Yeah, that sounds cool, but what about a distillery?" And I'm like, "I don't want to do a distillery. I don't even drink liquor." And so we drove up. We did a road trip to Chapel Hill. We met with Scott at Top of the Hill first so they could see a distillery and a brewery. And then we met with Sean at 00:22:0000:21:00 Fullsteam and we left. We, Stephen and I, said to the couple, "What do you think?" And 00:23:00 they said, "We think a distillery is a lot more expensive than a brewery." And I was like, "Yeah." And I don't know, that's just not what we're passionate about. And so by the time we got back to Tarboro Monday night, the town planner had emailed me. "I heard you all are going to start a brewery in North Carolina. Let me help." And I 00:24:00 was like... That's the beauty of Tarboro. Everybody knows your business when you weren't even telling your business. And this gentleman is now in Wilmington. He moved but he helped us write a grant through MainStreet Solutions based on building improvements, job creation, and double the investment. And that was a big thing for when we raised money with our investors. We've got this $200,000 grant that is going to help us build out. So I cannot say enough about the town of Tarboro and Edgecombe County. They are so supportive of progress and build and economic development that we ran into no obstacles, which is so different from what I hear from many. So if you want to open up a business in Tarboro, come on. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. 00:26:0000:25:00 No, that's great to hear, actually. It sounds like you already had the location well selected. You already had the building well selected. Tell me a little bit about the building itself and its history. What was it before? Inez Ribustello: It's an old Chevrolet dealership. It's the most charming building, I think, in the entire county. It's literally in the heart of downtown Tarboro. It is directly across the street from the post 00:27:00 office, one parking lot over from town hall. It has this amazing portico, and the taproom and the portico are where the car showrooms were. So you could drive cars on and off the lot. We still 00:28:00 have the original floor down. And then the back room was where they did repairs. And that's now the production facility, but so charming and special and just so much rich history. And 00:29:00 it's just a really cool spot that obviously, the acoustics aren't great. There're 00:30:00 plenty of things. Hindsight 2020, would it have been smarter to go into a strip mall and whatever? And that was brand new probably. But why do things easy? But yeah, no. It's a really cool building, and people remember it. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. And I think that adaptive reuse model works really well in North Carolina breweries in particular, in a lot of cities. 00:32:0000:31:00 Let's talk about how the name for the brewery came to be. Seems fairly obvious. But were there other names that you all thought about or did you just go, "We're naming it after the town"? Inez Ribustello: My goal is to have everybody that is cool and awesome and nice move to Tarboro. And if they can't move there, then I just at least want them to visit all 00:33:00 the time. And so really, this was about Tarboro. This wasn't about Stephen and Inez. This 00:34:00 wasn't about Franklin. This was about, "Hey, we want people to visit Tarboro." And 00:35:00 what better way than to say Tarboro Brewing Company? "Oh," I have the beer in Nashville, "Where's Tarboro?" Believe me, there are plenty of people who have not heard of Tarboro before. And at the same time, we didn't know Triangle Brewing Company was in Durham, TBC. But yeah, no. It was just that's what it was going to be. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. And you probably didn't have to fight anybody for the name of the place. Inez Ribustello: No, not at all. And I think part of if we wanted to be a community brewery, that was important. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. When you all first opened, how many folks did you have on staff? You mentioned working the floor of the restaurant a lot, but how was the brewery operating when you first opened? Inez Ribustello: In February when we sold our first keg wholesale. The business plan was really based off of Duck-Rabbit. We knew that Tarboro was small. We weren't going to really have enough people to come in to do a taproom, so we were just going to focus on the production. All the money that we raised in the grant was just on the 00:36:00 back. But like I said, the number of craft breweries had tripled. And when I was trying to sell 00:37:00 beer in Raleigh wholesale, they were like, "You're not local. Got 18 breweries here that are local." And I was like, "Oh my God." So literally at that time, I wasn't even on payroll. It was a brewer on site. Franklin wasn't on payroll either. A bartender... No, we didn't have a bartender because we didn't have a taproom. I think 00:38:00 it was just Bryce and Franklin and I were doing this. But when I realized that wholesale was not going to be able to be our business model, at least out of the gate, I sent an email to our current investors and said, "Hey all, we need to open a taproom immediately and I have to raise more money. If you're interested in coming in, let me know because it would be so much 00:39:00 easier to keep the cap table smaller. But if you know of anyone, we will take anyone's money." And literally raised an additional 100 grand that week and got the taproom open in June of '16. So we have two birthdays. We have the February 19th birthday, 2016, which is the production, and then June 5th, which is the taproom. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. Well, when you 00:40:00 first opened the taproom, how did the community react to having that kind of space? Inez Ribustello: So excited, just so excited. Very, "We've been waiting for this," and it was really, really special to watch. And what was really also special is seeing people we had never seen before who lived in Tarboro who just wanted to go into a taproom and drink a beer and weren't fans of the restaurant. Or not fans, but didn't feel... That wasn't their scene. But we have plenty of people and vice versa that frequent the restaurant that never come into the taproom and the other way around. So it's really cool because it's just broadened engagement. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. How would you describe your role at Tarboro? We 00:41:00 talked about titles mean nothing and there's so many of them to choose from, but what 00:42:00 responsibilities do you take on, I guess, at the beginning. We'll start with that, because I'm going to guess that they are different now from 2016. Inez Ribustello: Yeah. All the really boring stuff like payroll, sales tax, excise tax, admin stuff, scheduling food trucks. Erin Lawrimore: That's a full-time job. Inez Ribustello: Right. And thank God we have somebody else doing that now, I guess. She's like, "Food trucks are the bane of my 00:43:00 existence." I'm like, "No kidding." But now, I still do extras, payrolls, 00:44:00 sales tax. But really, I'm super hyperfocused on wholesale. And I've had to do social media, which everybody knows when Inez's in charge because it's so bad. And they're like, "Oh my God. It's her." But we are distributed in both North and South Carolinas, and we have a separate wholesaler for our immediate footprint then we do for statewide, so distributor relations. But I am hustling beer all over the state of North Carolina pretty much all the time, which is, it's really fun to share the story, especially as the story has become more. I love that. And also getting to share the love behind this brewery and behind the beer. And I'm so proud of the beer that Franklin makes. He stayed in Philadelphia and commuted for the first two years to make sure this was going to work. And he moved back full-time in, I guess, the summer of '18. And having him and what he's done in terms of the beers, the beers have always been great, but just really doing some cool styles. Tonight, I'm pouring at the Voracious & Rare Festival that Lighthouse puts on, and we have a 00:45:00 smoked Märzen. Who in North Carolina has a smoked Märzen? I don't know. But just fun stuff 00:46:00 like that, working with him. And he's got such this incredible reputation and history behind beer, and I just learn every day. But that's not anything. The role is whatever it takes. And I also am constantly drumming up investment. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. And we're going to get back later to future and growth, which will tie into the drumming up investments piece of the puzzle. But so you mentioned one of your big things is sharing the story, telling the story. How do you describe Tarboro Brewing Company to someone who's just unfamiliar with the brewery? Completely unfamiliar. Inez Ribustello: That we are a craft brewery in the heart of downtown Tarboro committed to revitalizing Eastern North Carolina. And we do that through serving our customers, our neighbors. We make fantastic beer but we're more than that. We are about making a better place to live for everyone. We use the brewery for farmers' markets, for COVID clinics. We've done teenage pregnancy workshops at the breweries at our taproom. You name it, we've done. But yeah, and it's so... I'm just so grateful that when people think of these things, they're like, "Hey, let's call TBC because we know 00:47:00 that's what they're about." Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. Let's talk a little bit more about some of the community engagement work that you all do. Do you have some particular events that stand out in your mind as just favorites or some of the things that were most meaningful to you? Inez Ribustello: Yeah, but I might start crying. Erin Lawrimore: Oh, no. That's okay. Inez Ribustello: We have done pre-COVID, we partnered with Eden, NC and Teach for America Eastern North Carolina, and did these crucial conversations one Wednesday a month that revolved around local issues that were pretty relevant, whether they be resilience or nutrition or race relations, really meaningful, impactful things. And that was just incredible to 00:48:00 see young people who were living in Tarboro, not necessarily from Tarboro like, "Oh wow, this is where I am." We had a young Teach for America core member. He wrote his first book of poetry at the taproom on bar by himself. He didn't know anybody. He moved to Tarboro. And then when he published it, he did the signing in our taproom. Erin Lawrimore: Aw. Inez Ribustello: And then when he did his second book, we brewed a beer with him in collaboration and did a second signing. Really, really neat stuff. We had the chairperson of the Civil Rights 00:49:00 Commission in Pitt County come and facilitate, I think it was eight Sundays in a row, on racial tension and racial relations in the November and December of 2020. We've had young women of color, entrepreneurs, do a pop-up market where they sold things they had made or created. And I'm missing stuff right now, but just really unbelievable partnerships that currently, one of my friends who's from Greensboro, she and her partner have a vintage and vinyl store, downtown Tarboro, and she bartends on Wednesday nights and has started BYOV, Bring Your Own Vinyl night. So the first people who bring in their records, the first three people get a free beer, and she plays people's vinyls. And how cool is that in Tarboro. We had a bakery where we did a bread beer and used their stale bread to make this table beer. But depending on the bread they gave us, the flavors changed. We've tried. We believe in collaboration even when it's 00:50:00 outside of the box. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah, that's really... As someone who comes from a very small town, it's always wonderful to hear about things like that in smaller towns too. You talked about the community being super supportive when you first opened. Were there any challenges other than probably the funding piece of the puzzle when you first were opening? Any other resources that you had to lean on for support in those early years? Inez Ribustello: In the early years, we opened up our doors with not enough cash, undercapitalized, which is the story of every startup, which makes me feel so much better. I'm like, "Oh, it's not just 00:51:00 me." Learning how to sell beer as a 40-year-old woman who was way old comparatively, and I had sold wine tableside my whole life, which nothing to it. I had people hunting me down for 00:52:00 reservations, wine tips, and now all of a sudden, people are crossing the street to the get to the other side so that they don't have to hear my pitch for beer. Just the learning curve for me was huge, and certainly had people in the beer industry who couldn't have been more generous or kind, but they weren't here. I wasn't in Raleigh. I wasn't in a Triangle where I could just go and settle up and say, "Give me all the tips." Our Guild is one of the best guilds in the country, and I have leaned on them since day one from when 00:53:00 Margaux is in charge to Rich to now Lisa. Thank God for them. They're a huge resource. I don't think people understand who are not part of the Guild what a resource they are. But I 00:54:00 just think the learning curve for me, and certainly along with being undercapitalized, we were 00:55:00 understaffed. Even now, we have a very small staff of four full-time people, and that's for TBC Tarboro and our satellite TBC West. It's not a lot of people from... Yeah, so I think that was it. Erin Lawrimore: And we're going to come back to TBC West in a minute because like I said, I was out in Rocky Mount a couple of weeks ago. But before that, we have to get to the elephant in the room for any conversation these days, which is 2020, and everything that went down around COVID. It seems silly to ask, did it impact your operations? But I guess thinking about those early days, the really scary, no one knows what's happening days, how did you all react to that? Did you feel like you were going into something and you felt grounded or was there no ground? Inez Ribustello: I am a survivor of 9/11, and so everything is relative to that. I am a believer in you're never in control. So this was happening. I laid myself off, and who knew I could apply for PPP loans and do it well. So I was applying for EIDL, PPP, eventually, Restaurant Relief. I'm like, "I need to quit the brewery and somebody can hire me just 00:56:00 to write these applications on..." But people came out and support with buying merchandise, and we went in to COVID with more keg beer than we'd ever had, which draft died. You 00:57:00 couldn't sell it out of your taprooms and you couldn't sell it wholesale because no place, they weren't essential. So we pivoted it a little bit. We started canning from keg, which you can't sell wholesale but we could sell it out of the taproom. That was fun. We did some different blanket labels, like a Pants Drunk label and a Portico Series label. Erin Lawrimore: Had you been canning before that? Inez Ribustello: We had. But we'd never canned from keg. But we had to figure out how we were going to do this. We teamed up with Paul from 00:58:00 Duck-Rabbit and Ryan from Casita and did three different hope beers, and the first two were a 00:59:00 blending of kegs that we canned. And then the third one was an actual brew. Released those in March, May, and then November of 2020. We teamed up with Food Lion and asked them to buy 20 cases of our most popular beer at both locations. And then did a contest that if you took a picture of you with your four-pack and a food line receipt, you were eligible for $100 gift certificate to 01:00:00 Food Lion. And then did an additional one for an educator. We did some really cool things and had tremendous community support. Sadly, what really destroyed us the most was that we made a stance where we put Black Lives Matter on our windows. And that was really sad to watch people actively not support us. Even now, people have not forgotten. But that goes back when we kept that up from June to November, the Wednesday before Thanksgiving. And when I took it down, I replaced it with these Sunday series with this gentleman to come and facilitate and invited people who had 01:01:00 actively boycotted the brewery and they said, no, they weren't coming. So we reached out to local city council, law enforcement educators and had these really meaningful conversations around racial equity and racial justice, which turned into this fabulous committee, that turned into a conference we presented at the community college where we had people in the arts, athletics, education, politicians, ministry, everybody. There was a Black person and a white person talk about why it's so important to embrace one another. It's called Cue the 01:02:00 Conversation. It's community, unity, and equity. So that was really special to watch that turn into anything, but it wasn't really COVID that changed the support. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. And I think you've hinted at this all along, but it sounds like diversity, equity, and 01:03:00 inclusion has always been a thread through the business and some of the community work that you're doing. Inez Ribustello: Yes. I feel very strongly. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. And the community conversations that you mentioned, you said it was eight weeks on Sundays? Inez Ribustello: Mm-hmm. Erin Lawrimore: Wow. That's a really awesome commitment. You've mentioned a couple of times TBC West in Rocky Mount. Can you talk a little bit about that, the decision to do that and why Rocky Mount Mills? Inez Ribustello: Rocky Mount Mills was really 01:04:00 getting off the ground when we were starting TBC 2013, '14, '15-ish. And I had gotten 01:05:00 to be really close with the woman named Evan Covington Chavez. I think she's the VP of commercial real estate for Capital Broadcasting. And we were watching Koi Pond. Koi Pond opened in January of 2016. We opened our production in February. And my dad has always taught me more business is not competition. It's just more reason to it. Business breeds more business. And so just keeping that relationship open. And honestly, we knew within six months of the taproom being open that we needed another revenue generator, vital. And the Rocky Mount Mills have been 01:06:00 the best partners. They are really unbelievable people. Scott Roberts, who manages it, I don't know what I would do without him, but they came in and said, "Come into this space and it'll give you another spot to sell your beer." They were pretty firm and they wanted it to have food. And of course there is no money-making in food, but we just created this really simple taco-driven, chips and dip-driven menu, which is I think is fantastic with beer. And so we have nine taps over there. It's also been a great little six-barrel system that Franklin can R&D on, which we have used many times to create a draft beer and see how well it sells to determine if we want to brew it on the 20-barrel system. Erin Lawrimore: Interesting. Inez Ribustello: Yeah. So it's just been a win, win, win, win, win, win all the way around. And there are plenty of people who are coming off 95 who stop in that Mills who were 01:07:00 never coming to Tarboro, so it's just a bonus. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. What kind of support is offered through the mill beyond just having a space there, especially with so many breweries there? Inez Ribustello: They are so active in sending out social media, emails. They've got all these tenants both in the mill houses and in the loft departments and just keeping whatever we're doing in the focus of their tenants. They do tons of events, tons that bring people to the Mills. Their tiny house hotel, people come in. There is a card that says all of the amenities 01:08:00 on campus. They do a monthly music series. They're so involved in the community. On Thursday of next week, they're supporting Meals on Wheels, Beans & Brews. But that type of support. And obviously, the space is huge but very active in, if there's an opportunity to advertise on our behalf where they pick up the tab, they do it. I don't know how to say all the things that they do for their tenants, but it's pretty remarkable. We feel very supported. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. That's fantastic. Are there other ways from the beginning 01:09:00 to now that you've seen TBC evolve since it first opened? Inez Ribustello: Yes. I've gotten to brew with Briana Break three times. We did this collaborative beer, it was a strawberry milkshake IPA called FYPM. It's her recipe. First time we did it, we did it in TBC West on our little six-barrel system and just kegged it. And the second time we did it on her location in 01:10:00 her 10-barrel system and we just kegged it. And then the third time, she came to Tarboro and we canned it and kegged it and sold it. So I never thought I would brew. She did it. I was doing the Instagram, corny Instagram- Erin Lawrimore: Stir sometimes. Inez Ribustello: What would you like 01:11:00 me to do? It makes it look like I'm helping. Erin Lawrimore: I've done that. Inez Ribustello: I'll lift something. But yeah, so that's been an evolve that I just love. Being able to make something is really neat. But how to tell your story, that's definitely evolved. Well, the story's evolved, and just the importance of connecting with other brewers and realizing that that is very valuable. I have to make time to go and talk to other brewers, brewery operators, and claim knowledge from them. And sometimes I get so bogged down with just the little bitties that I'm not realizing. One of the coolest things that has happened, we have helped design a brewery software that is getting ready to go live next month, that we will be the initial users of that I think is going to change how we sell. And I never thought of myself as someone who would develop software, but connected with a old friend from high school 01:12:00 who I had not seen in 30 years, and that's her gift. And she's done legal software, banking software, and she's like, "I want to help you. I want to help you be successful." That launches next month, Ohana Path. That's a huge evolvement. I'm like, "Would I say it? How did this happen?" I've gotten to be great friends with a veteran craft beer salesman who lives in and is retired in Wilson. And just he has taken me under his wing and, "Hey, you need to do this. If you want to survive, you've got to do this." And so all these relationships that have come out of this that I know would not have been possible without opening TBC. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. And thinking, I guess, forward, what are 01:13:00 your hopes and dreams for the next short-term future, next few years, but also thinking a little bit further down the line? Inez Ribustello: Yeah. Obviously, cash flow positive is a dream, but I am committed to it. Growing our team, being able to be a place where we can pay people livable wage and be a place they want to come to work and they enjoy what they're doing. Who doesn't enjoy working at a brewery? It's really freaking fun. But being able to grow that, I'm not going to lie, I'm planning on 18 wheelers up and down on 95 that have our beer on the sign. And continuing to learn about what breweries can be doing. Don't think we mentioned this, but the trend of drinking alcohol is going down. We're getting ready to launch a non-alcoholic beer in partnership with, again, a young person who is from Tarboro who I've known his whole life, and that's going to be come out in January. But just continuing to do things that are meaningful, whether that be make different styles of beer, or whether that be using our space for impactful programs, or whether it be telling the story to different people who will move to Tarboro. Erin Lawrimore: Oh. Well, let's talk about the beer. Inez Ribustello: Yeah. Erin Lawrimore: Tell me a little bit about the TBC's beer. Do you have beers that you consider your core beers or your flagship beers? Inez Ribustello: We do, and they're not the beers that we started with. Erin Lawrimore: So we'll start with what did you start with? Inez Ribustello: We started with four ales. We started with a Belgian-style pale brew with honey called Nana's Roof. And that was named after my grandmother, my namesake, who gave us the money for the down payment of the roof of the building. And so I told her we would name a beer after her. The other one was The Town Common, which is brewed like an ESB. We called it an American ale. The other one was a rye, IPA. And then the other one was a Belgian Dubbel. And delicious beers, all four of them. It became very evident early on that we were not... that there was a big part of Tarboro in Edgecombe County who weren't coming in because we didn't have Bud Light or Michelob ULTRA. And so Franklin said, "Let me brew a beer that will taste better than that but will hit the spot." And he brewed a 3.7% all malt, no corn, light lager that is now our flagship beer. Not just in the taproom, but wholesale. Not just in draft, but in cans. ECU is now on its third year of having it for their home football games and home baseball games. We sell it in Charleston, South Carolina. It's a big beer for us. And then another beer that is our core is our salted watermelon gose. We brew with 1300 pounds of fresh watermelon, cut up puree with an immersion blender, dump into the fermenter, no filtration whatsoever, add a little salt at the end. I call it my 3B beer, beach, boat, and breakfast. That is a huge seller for us. We pasteurize our cans so there's no risk of having an explosion in your bottle shop. We learned that the hard way. Erin Lawrimore: I think a lot of new breweries learn that one the hard way. Inez Ribustello: Oh my gosh. I'm like, "This is when I just give up." Erin Lawrimore: Was the learning experience with the gose or was it with a darker beer? Inez Ribustello: No, it was with the gose. Erin Lawrimore: Okay. Inez Ribustello: Yeah, almost goes... Yeah. And then our third flagship that we just released in 2022 is our Bobby Boucher IPA, which is a 6.5% juicy hazy that we brew in partnership with Sound Rivers, which is a non-profit dedicated to making North Carolina rivers more fishable, swimmable, drinkable, because you cannot make great beer without great water. And so Caty Gray Urquhart who is our TBC team leader, she serves on the board of Sound Rivers and that beer just out of the gate. So Town Common, the ESB has now become a seasonal, the Belgian Dubbel has become a seasonal. First Rye'd And Nana's Roof aren't even on the production calendar right now. But so our three cores are the Sexy Canoe, the Seed Spitter, and the Bobby Boucher IPA. Erin Lawrimore: Those are great names. Inez Ribustello: No, I know. Erin Lawrimore: How do you choose? Do you choose the name? Who's the name chooser? Inez Ribustello: The Bobby Boucher IPA is actually a former salesperson who, he thought of that. His name is Elton Liam. He's like, "You got to call it this." And I will confess, I've never seen the water boy so I don't know. That sounds old. But the Seed Spitter, this is really cool. When we released it on draft, we have a big chalkboard wall and we said, "Name that beer," and people just started writing names on the chalkboard wall and then ticking off what was the name? So we don't know who named the Seed Spitter, yeah. That's billable. Erin Lawrimore: Oh, that's interesting. Inez Ribustello: And then the Sexy Canoe, you can edit this, but there's a beer joke. What's the difference between drinking Bud Light and having sex in a canoe? There's no difference. They're both fucking close to water. So this is our craft canoe beer. You got a Sexy Canoe. People love it, but... Erin Lawrimore: That's awesome. That's fantastic. No. And you mentioned that you all do a lot of, you mentioned seasonals and you mentioned some of the R&D beers. Inez Ribustello: Yeah. Erin Lawrimore: Do you have any of those that stand out in your brain as favorites, or either favorites of yours or favorites just in general with sales? Inez Ribustello: Yeah. So Sunny Side Up which is a pale coffee ale that we brew with Lenocka, who's in Farmville. Great guy, his beans. That was one that we made several times at TBC West and just did in draft. And then it was like the people have spoken. They want this beer. And so we canned it for the first time in 2022. One of my dear friend's daughters who is at Hollands, she's an artist. We used her artwork on it. Erin Lawrimore: Oh, wow. Inez Ribustello: That's pretty cool. I just love that beer. I just don't think... A lot of times when you have coffee beers, you think of porters and stouts, and this is beautiful golden color, a big fan of that. I should say one of the most meaningful things that has happened and has been a huge game changer for us is in, I think it was 2018 or '19, we partnered with ECU School of Design and gave them some beer names for their students to design labels. And one woman, her name is Lexi Malpas, she designed our October Fest can. And it was so great that we used it. And since then, she's graduated. She lives in Wilmington, and she's our label designer. So just from that partnership where we organically worked with a team of students, now she's a subcontractor for TBC. Young woman, talented, amazing person. Erin Lawrimore: That's awesome. Inez Ribustello: Yeah, pretty cool. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. Let's talk a little bit about the physical space in Tarboro. We talked about the building, but talk a little bit more about the production size and I guess the size and scale of taproom. Obviously we're not in the taproom, so it's harder to get a sense of that here, but if you could just kind of try to describe? Inez Ribustello: Yeah. Between the taproom and the portico, that's about 3500, 4000 square feet of space. Taproom, original tile floors. We've got a couch in there would connect for some games. We've built a concrete bar and it's in the back of the... It hits the taproom or the production facility. And then outside on the portico, we've got a little picnic table, rocking chairs. It's a really fun space. And then the production facility, we have four 40-barrel fermenters, one 20-barrel fermenter that we've added that wasn't always there. Huge refrigeration. My husband who's a chef who believes there's never enough refrigeration, he's like, "Oh, I'm so jealous." Franklin designed the flow of it. Our mash hunt that is in the back is gravity-fed. So he lifts the grain up with a forklift and then feeds it through our cold liquor tank, hot liquor tank. And then pallets of cans and kegs. Erin Lawrimore: And do you have a canning line? Inez Ribustello: We did. We sold it in 2021 and now are using Iron Heart Mobile Canning, which is, it's been great. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. We touched on this a little bit at the very beginning, but I also promised we would circle back around to it. Let's talk a little bit more about how your wine experience and background feeds into what you do with beer now. Can you talk a little bit about your knowledge base of wine and how it informs either how you talk about and how you view beer? Inez Ribustello: Yeah. I'm really fortunate to work with our team who believes that beer is enjoyed with food. And the reason you can enjoy it with food is when it's balanced. And so our beers are not the highest at ABV. They're not the hoppiest. They're not the most crazy adjuncts. They're beer that pairs well. Like the Seed Spitter with sushi, phenomenal. As part of the sommelier program, when I was studying through the Court of Master Sommeliers, beer was you were expected no beer fermentation, ales versus lag or the whole thing and history of beer. But really for me, smelling, tasting, that's what I love. And so that's what I love, and I also love making accessible. So I'm never going to talk to you about wine and talk about the bricks at harvest. It's not. But I am going to say, "Hey, I'm getting this crazy peach flavor. What are you getting?" And then, "Hey, what would you drink this with?" And sometimes, I wouldn't near you with anything. I just want to have a glass of wine or I just want to have a pint of beer. So just really figuring out how this beer is relatable. Because there are some people like, "I don't drink beer." People say, "I don't drink beer." And my favorite challenge is, "Try this one." And because we have beer that non-beer drinkers like, and we're really proud of that. Erin Lawrimore: What do you usually point a non-beer drinker to first? Inez Ribustello: Seed Spitter. Erin Lawrimore: Seed Spitter? Inez Ribustello: Yeah. And 9 times out of 10, people were into it. And then the whole food pairing. I love going into accounts and saying, "Your menu is phenomenal. And if I was coming here, I would definitely do this with..." Just relation, the relatable stuff. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. And in Tarboro, you mentioned your light lager. Do you all also have a lot of folks who just come in and say, "I've never had craft beer. What do I do?" Inez Ribustello: Yeah. And that Sexy Canoe is the gateway beer. And what's really cool, and Stephen and I saw the same thing. When we opened on the Square and people came in and said, "May I have a glass of white Zinfandel?" and we said, "We don't have white Zinfandel, but we have this beautiful off-dry German Riesling," and the evolvement. And now these people are drinking Von Der Leyen. But trust, it's all about trust. And if you're not listening to what people are saying, then it's going to be really hard to get to build a trust and to figure out how to make people loyal. And so there are plenty of people who came in for Sexy Canoe, and now they're drinking Southern Solstice Stout or Bobby Boucher IPA. And some of them aren't. Some of them are just going to drink like my dad. He's going to drink Sexy Canoe, season two. And that was his only guidance towards me. "Please make a beer I can drink more than one of." "You know what? We got you, Rusty." Erin Lawrimore: Oh. Well yeah, you've got to have beer for Dad. Inez Ribustello: Yeah. Erin Lawrimore: Let's think about the industry as a whole, the craft beer industry as a whole. What are some of the biggest changes you've seen in the industry since you first started? For good or for bad, I suppose, but how has the industry evolved? Inez Ribustello: In the best news, it's more diverse. I'm seeing more people of color, more women. And I think that speaks to the industry, that it's welcoming. This crowd of brewers, they're actively engaged in DEI and they really know this is the right thing. It's vital and it's only going to make everyone stronger. So I love seeing that. Certainly, I love seeing breweries pop up in small towns. I think that is just so fun. We've just seen three pop up in Little Washington, one or two pop up in Warrenton. Just how cool was that that people were knowing? That's something. We don't want our small towns to die. We want them to keep being places where people can live and be happy. And the ways people are collaborating is just really cool. And I see that as progressing for the rest of the time. I think laws are changing. Certainly at some point, the brewery isn't going to be at the total mercy of the wholesaler. And then of course at the same time, people are like, "This is not just this easy. I'm going to do this," and all of a sudden I'm going to be flooded with cash. You cannot go in, I don't think, and make mediocre beer. There's no room for mediocre beer, which is great. But I don't know. I'm sure there are ways it's going to change that I haven't even thought about. But those are the ones that I see happening in the industry, or I may predict happening in the industry. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. And that's what I was going to get to next. And if you had your way, where would you like to see the industry as a whole in 10 years? Inez Ribustello: Well, I'd certainly like people to drink more beer because that's only going to help the whole industry. I've seen since we've released Sexy Canoe, more breweries figure out we need a light low ABV beer. Because there is nothing more I love than having a beer at lunch, and I'm never going to have a beer that's over 5% at lunch or I would not go back to work, or I might after a three-hour nap. You see in Europe, people drink beer at lunch. And I think maybe if we can figure out how to make more beers that are lunch-drinking, you'll see that, because I'm probably never going to have a glass of wine at lunch. Certainly not going to have a liquor drink at lunch unless I'm off, unless I'm off. Erin Lawrimore: When you have the time for that nap. Inez Ribustello: Right, exactly. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. Are there any industry trends today that stand out to you as things you particularly love or that honestly you're like, "I would not ever want to see that in my brewery"? Inez Ribustello: Well, I think it is super trendy to collaborate. I love that. Erin Lawrimore: What are some of your favorite collabs that you all have done? You mentioned working with Briana at Spaceway. Inez Ribustello: Yeah, that was really fun. And then we did the several with Duck-Rabbit and Casita, and that was super fun too. We've done maybe two or three with Koi Pond who we just love. They were the first ones at Rocky Mountain Mills and they've been such great neighbors. I'm trying to think. And then we've done the collaborations with the bakery and the coffee roaster. But I think more of those, maybe not even just brewery-brewery, but other, I can't even think, other craftsmen, craftswomen and how to figure that out too. I love, certainly with us, being an incubator for young people to come in and saying, "I'm thinking about doing this as a startup. Can I spend some time here? And can you mentor?" Things that I don't love, it's like well, what don't I love? I don't know. I don't have anything. If I don't like it, we're not doing it. So who am I to say what other people can do? Yeah. No, I don't. I love the different design piece of the artwork and how that's an outlet for somebody. But I can't think of anything that somebody's doing that I dislike. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. Well, when you think about North Carolina beer or even Southern Beer, but specifically North Carolina beer, do you see anything unique about North Carolina's beer scene versus other states, other areas, other regions? Inez Ribustello: I think the Guild is the number one. Our guild is unbelievable. And I know from speaking to people in South Carolina and Virginia that that's not their experience. Sorry. I won't say they have that. Erin Lawrimore: You're not the first person I've interviewed who said that. Inez Ribustello: I think we stand out in that. I'll tell you what's been really cool is when we first got statewide distribution and I went to work the market in Nashville, I was a nervous wreck because I was like, "Oh my God, Asheville looked just so sophisticated," and they've been a huge market for us. They really enjoyed our beer and we have great representation in Asheville, which is so cool. And I think that's cool because in Charlotte and Raleigh, it's hard because they're like, "We're going for breweries that are in Charlotte and Raleigh." And Asheville has said, "Well, we want to support North Carolina." But people can go and have actual beer at those breweries. "So we're going to support North Carolina beer but we're going to have others." And what was really cool when the Guild did the Label Insanity program and we made it to the Elite 8 and we lost to Cellarest in Asheville who ended up winning the whole thing. I actually say we were a first runner up, so goes to them. We sent them some beer and said, "Congratulations." And they're like, "Oh my God, this is so cool. You all gave us..." And you know what they said? "Your community really came out for you," because it was a people's choice. You voted on it. And I was like, "Well, that's because I had every eighth grader at Martin Millennium and every 12th grader at North Carolina school science and math voting on us." I was calling my children both, "Vote for..." Erin Lawrimore: Nothing like recruiting the kids for the beer label competition. Inez Ribustello: Exactly. That was fun. But I do think North Carolina is pretty special. Next week, I'll go to Winston-Salem for the Brewers Conference. And I don't know, I think the way North Carolina craft breweries really use their bounty is pretty special. I don't know enough about other states to know if they do that. I'm sure they do, but it feels very heightened here from Sean for the persimmon, the jalapeño rage. I think that's pretty cool that North Carolina is doing that. Erin Lawrimore: So yeah. We've come to two of my favorite questions. What is your favorite beer from your brewery? What is your personal favorite? It can either be something that's only done once or something that's flagship. Inez Ribustello: I drink my weight in Seed Spitter. I really do. I just love that the beer. Erin Lawrimore: What is it about that beer that really speaks to you? Inez Ribustello: It's just, well, it changes. Because we use fresh fruit, fresh watermelon, it changes with the season. So when it comes out in May, it's a little tarter, whereas it comes out in the fall, it's super juicy. But just that salt and I just love that. I also think it's pretty cool when you drink the very bottom of most beer, everybody's like, "Eh, I don't want to drink." But Seed Spitter, it's like the angel share at the bottom because the pulp is subtle. It's my favorite part of the beer, the glass up. Erin Lawrimore: It's where the juice is. Inez Ribustello: Yeah, it's where the juice is. But I'll tell you, proceed. I don't want to not give it the love. But our bartender, who is also our defensive line coach for our high school football team, he is a dunkel fanatic. And he and Franklin have brewed the dunkel a couple of times at TBC West. And they just brewed it in May or June at TBC Tarboro. So we could have a dark beer on tap in the summer. I couldn't get enough of it. So the Tarboro House Dunkel, I think that those two. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. And what about favorite beers from North Carolina breweries other than yours? Inez Ribustello: Well, I have to shout out Briana Break because Spaceway is like, I just love it so much. And she just released this Honey Saison with honey from Conetoe Family Life Center, and that beer is just popping. Erin Lawrimore: She explained it to me as honey harvested by tiny children. Inez Ribustello: That's so funny. And now I love it even more. Oh, yeah. I'm a huge fan. This is such a tough question. Erin Lawrimore: I know, I know. And this is why we don't ever just say your favorite beer and leave it at that. Usually it's beers. Inez Ribustello: Yeah, I am. In fact, when I go out, I try to just drink North Carolina beers. I'm partial to low ABV ones, but yeah. So I had that one recently, Swells'a in Nags Head. Arrel Burrow works there and he's one of my favorite people ever. And he just gave us a wet hop IPA. They overnighted the hops in from Idaho. That's really, really good. I can't remember the name, but that was fun. And Duck-Rabbit's Märzen is one of my favorite beers. I feel like I need to shout out. Everybody has a beer in North Carolina that I love to drink, and so... Erin Lawrimore: Well, and this may be plays in too and this is the final thing I wanted to have you talk about, is just thinking about the wine industry versus the beer industry and the flavor differences and things like that, and what similarities and differences you see between those two realms. Inez Ribustello: This is where I get into the psychology in the wine versus the beer. A wine drinker is super fiercely loyal, either to the grape or the brand like, "I only drink Cabernet. I only drink Serra. I only drink Pinot Gris." And certainly, there are plenty of people who say, "I only drink Bacchus Cabernet," or, "I only drink A to Z Pinot Gris." Paul and I have talked about this, but the beer drinker, the craft beer drinker, "That's the best beer I've ever had. Check. I never need to drink it again." How do you sell? So it's fascinating to me. And I know why labels sell wine. Labels really sell beer. I have no idea that the importance of a label. But I feel like craft beer drinkers are always on to the next. And maybe that's just one section that I've experienced. Because I can go back and argue that Sexy Canoe, that person that's coming into the taproom to drink Sexy Canoe is only going to drink Sexy Canoe. But I know that with wine, it seemed like a more loyalist. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. No, I think that makes sense. And I'm definitely guilty of being one of the, "Check, I've had that beer. Let's go find another one." Let's see if I can tap. Inez Ribustello: Did I? Did I? Yeah. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. Well, the last thing I wanted to ask you about is your book. You published a book. Inez Ribustello: I did. Erin Lawrimore: Tell me a little bit about that. Inez Ribustello: I'm a journaler. I've been journaling my entire life and finally got the nerve up to actually work with an editor and self-published it to come out the 20th anniversary of 9/11. And I had very low expectations on what would happen, but it has opened up so many amazing conversations, connections, and really helped me be more confident in sharing the story of TBC. There's a chapter dedicated. My daughter went on Good Reads and she was like, "This woman blasted you and said wasn't about 9/11." I was like, "Well, I never said it was." Also, never read the reviews. Erin Lawrimore: No. Inez Ribustello: But yeah. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah, whether it's for beer or books, don't read the reviews. Inez Ribustello: Exactly, don't do it. Don't do it. It was about coming back Tarboro after losing major in job and creating a family. My husband had two children and how I had to put up a healthy boundary with myself in the restaurant and then coming over and doing TBC. It's wild. I didn't know that 2020... I knew 2021 was going to be this life changing thing because I was going to put the book out there, but I didn't know that 2022 would be even more life changing. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah, it seems like each year we can label a different way. Yeah, exactly. Inez Ribustello: 2020, yeah. They're all. Erin Lawrimore: Yeah. No, awesome. Is there anything we haven't talked about that you feel we should talk about to get your full story or the full TBC story? Inez Ribustello: No, I feel like I've talked so much. You probably need a beer. Erin Lawrimore: No, it's been perfect. It's been perfect. Well, thank you so much. Inez Ribustello: